Updated November 14, 2013 at 6:20 pm:
According to the TTC CEO’s report for November, the date for resumption of streetcar service on Queens Quay has been changed to June 21, 2014. Brad Ross of the TTC advises that their website will be updated to reflect this new target date.
Updated October 26, 2013 at 4:32 pm:
According to the TTC CEO’s report for October (at page 20), service will not resume on Queens Quay until August 2014, not the end of June as previously reported. I have asked the TTC to verify this date and explain why completion has slipped yet again.
The TTC memo listing service changes for the November and December schedule periods came out today, and it contains a few startling items:
- The Yonge Subway tunnel liner program, originally expected to wrap up at the end of 2013, will now run an additional year to the end of 2014.
- The loop at the foot of Queens Quay will not be available for service as expected in November, and service on the 510 streetcar will not resume until mid-February 2014.
- The track on Queens Quay itself will not be available for service as expected in December/January, and service on the 509/510 streetcar will not resume until the end of June 2014.
Updated October 2, 2013 at 10:25 am:
Waterfront Toronto has posted a Construction Update for the Queens Quay project.
Updated October 1, 2013 at 6:00 pm:
Yonge Subway Tunnel Liners
I have received a note from Brad Ross at the TTC explaining the current situation. The work has proven more extensive both in complexity and scope than originally thought. In reply to one comment in this thread, I gave the opinion that all of the asbestos had been removed from the tunnels, but according to Ross, there is still some present and this adds to the slowness of the work.
The tunnel liner project involves the inspection of some 10,000 tunnel liners. To date, 4,000 liners have been inspected, 950 identified in need of repair, and 850 of them repaired. The process is not a speedy one as many of the liners are covered in material, including asbestos, which needs to be removed before a liner can be inspected. Add to that the time it takes for crews to get to the work location, set up, clean up, and return to the yard. As we examine liners, we’re identifying more and more that need to be repaired, mostly due to water damage. In short, the project timeline increases as the work involved increases. We are now working to determine what a reasonable completion date might look like and what the overall impact to subway service north of Eglinton will be over the next 12-18 months. Once we have that, we’ll communicate it widely.
[Email from Brad Ross, Executive Director, Corporate Communications, TTC, October 1, 2013]
Waterfront Toronto Queens Quay Project
I met with Waterfront Toronto staff to discuss the status of the project. They have issued a construction update detailing the current situation.
Because the lanes occupied by the TTC right-of-way are essential as extra space into which construction or temporary road lanes can be shifted for utility work, the new trackbed cannot be laid down until all utility work requiring traffic diversions in an area is completed.
This work has been affected by a number of factors notably:
- A late start by Toronto Hydro who did not receive funding approval for their Capital Program from the Ontario Energy Board in time to meet the original schedule.
- Ground water conditions that at some locations were more challenging than expected.
- Subsidence and resulting damage to existing utilities when areas were de-watered for construction access. This was anticipated, but the extent of the problem is hard to gauge before the work is actually done.
The area around Spadina and Queens Quay has many utilities competing for space and for construction access. Some planned work has been complicated by new, more stringent provincial labour safety standards for work near live hydro lines.
Most of the splicing chambers for the new track are complete, but one critical one that will feed Queens Quay Loop is inaccessible at present due to competing work in the same area. This has slowed installation of the grounding cables for the loop which will tie back to that chamber.
The intent is to have the trackwork in the loop finished by yearend. TTC would then install its overhead in preparation for service at the start of the February 2014 schedule period which will fall in the middle of the month. The track installation will likely be done mainly in November, and partial shutdowns of the streets around the loop will be required.
There are three sets of special work (loop entrance from Queens Quay, loop exit to Spadina and the Spadina & Queens Quay intersection). A preliminary plan for this might have broken the work into three stages, but Waterfront Toronto hopes to consolidate this into two.
A further complication will be the partial closing of Lake Shore Blvd. to complete the track connection south from new rails on Spadina.
Waterfront Toronto expects to publish details of the work schedule soon.
As for the tangent track on Queens Quay, the major constraint is that the space cannot be given up until utility work in a section is clear. The intention is to build the foundation slab in pieces as various sections of the roadway become available. Track installation would be completed in spring 2014, followed by overhead catenary, with a target date for streetcar service in late June. (If the schedule periods for 2014 follow the same pattern as in 2013, this would be Sunday, June 22, 2014.)
Waterfront Toronto’s work plan for summer-fall 2014 will concentrate on the area south of the streetcar right-of-way which will contain the new cycling path, an expanded pedestrian area, and many trees. Some finishing work will occur in early 2015 in advance of the Pan Am Games.
What is frustrating about all of this is that the delay in Hydro’s approval at the OEB was well known a year ago, and Waterfront Toronto has maintained rather hopeful dates for resumption of service that strained credibility as the construction wore on and on and on.
Steve Munro 
The Queens Quay delay comes as no great surprise. The only trackwork that has been done along there was the ripping up of the old track. The delay is obviously in the sewer and other road work etc. having nothing to do with the TTC. I suspect the delay in the loop is related.
And to think we are now hearing shortened times for constructing a Scarborough subway.
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From my perspective at least the Queens Quay loop should have been completed on time. I pass by Spadina and Queens Quay on a semi weekly basis and work has been at a stand still for what seems like months now. Either contractors are dragging their feet on this simple and important piece of the puzzle, Waterfront Toronto is hoping to delay spending to keep within a budget allocation, or they’ve found the remains if that long fabled whale carcass under Queens Quay and we can expect a historical extravaganza.
Either way there needs to be some serious answers to these delays. As always thanks for keeping a watchful eye Steve.
Cheers,
Brandon
Steve: The status of this part of the work for a few weeks has been that they are working on the future electrical connections to the loop. It is unclear why this is taking so long.
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Absolutely shocking. Absolutely shocking.
Just last week Andy Byfield stood in front of the TTC and said that Yonge would be restored in late 2013, and Queens Quay would be restored in January 2014.
And just 3 business days later it’s late 2014 and June 2014.
Either Andy Byfield should be disciplined for blatantly lying to the commission, or whoever is running these projects should be discplined for a complete failure in change management.
The complete and total incompetence of the TTC to manage construction projects is disgraceful.
Media tweeted during last TTC meeting that Stintz said that there was a perception that TTC doesn’t manage projects well. Do you know if there was any context to this?
Does she really think it’s only a perception?? LOL!
Steve: Stintz is always worried about TTC image, and by extension, her own credibility. This was, if memory serves, part of the discussion about alternate routes for the Scarborough subway and who might be responsible for the project.
It is a common attitude at Queen’s Park that the municipal level of government is incompetent. George Smitherman had this attitude when he started his campaign, and it took up until September, when he realized that he was losing, to understand that all wisdom does not flow from Ministry staff. Indeed, Queen’s Park has screwed up a lot of transit plans in Toronto, most recently the debate over the Scarborough line.
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Wow … Harbourfront a mess until June of next year?!? Regardless of why, that is just far too long to leave a major tourist area for the city such a mess.
I suspect there will be discussion of the “Harbourfront streetcar disaster” within the next week or so.
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The irony is, that for the really big projects, TTC seems to manage them relatively well. Sheppard subway, Downsview extension, Spadina extension, Union second platform. The ones where the contractor is often a well known reputable entity.
It’s the smaller projects … the elevators, second exits, pavement, etc. which gets the second string contractors or internal workers that seem to go woefully wrong.
That being said, they seem to get some stuff relatively right … simple track and intersection replacement seems to have become very routine and relatively painless (other than the originally planned window).
I’d assume Queens Quay is coming out of Waterfront Toronto issues.
There does seem to be a systemic reporting failure however. Surely Yonge doesn’t go from needing another 3 months to 15 months in 3 days.
It would be nice if some of the new private-sector Commissioners would hold Byford’s feet to the fire, and ask how there could be such a huge change in what he was reporting to them. I won’t hold my breath though.
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Wow, another year for that subway tunnel. This is what, in its fifth year now? They could have built roughed-in express track parallel tunnels in that time.
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I am not surprised about the North Yonge work taking longer than expected as it has become commonplace to extend the work at a whim. No doubt there will be calls soon for another extended closure as was the case with Pape to get the work done. I doubt there is both the political will and public desire to see this drag on forever especially since it’s an election year.
Steve: Don’t forget as well that there will be an extended shutdown of the line between St. Clair and Eglinton for reconstruction of the roadbed from Muir to Berwick portal. I am willing to bet that nobody will think of making Yonge an exclusive transit street for the shuttle buses.
As for Queens Quay again I am not surprised given the state of the road currently. I can also expect fallout from this much like there was with St. Clair. Queens Quay has dragged on for too long and it needs some sort of normalcy again.
All in all if this memo you speak of is correct there will be questions and no doubt heads will roll.
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Has the TTC EVER finished ANY project on time?
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I am not surprised by this. Transit work always seems to take long than what the TTC claims. Also, I passed Fleet St. yesterday and I could see a section of track was removed with a whole in the ground where the track was. I knew right then that the work would take longer than expected.
Steve: Fleet Street is part of the Bathurst route where Waterfront Toronto is doing work. This is separate from the QQ project.
And do not assume that Queen’s Quay will be up and running by June. There will be delays due to a multitude of reasons, some legitimate ones (i.e. weather) but others are suspicious at times (like work took longer than expected when they should be factoring delays into large projects to begin with.)
Steve: We already know that Hydro was 6 months late starting because they were awaiting budget approval, and Waterfront Toronto has done a lot of work to shuffle parts of the project around them (Hydro has helped on that too). What we really need is an updated overall plan, and I am waiting somewhat impatiently for replies to my queries.
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This is the construction that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started constructing it, not knowing what it was, and they’ll continue constructing it forever just because… This is the construction that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started constructing it, not knowing what it was, and they’ll continue constructing it forever just because… This is the construction that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started constructing it, not knowing what it was, and they’ll continue constructing it forever just because… This is the construction that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some people started constructing it, not knowing what it was, and they’ll continue constructing it forever just because…
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It’s been dragging on for years. Nobody really cares much about it taking longer. Politically, it would be far more damaging to suggest an extended closure. And, no way they close the north part of Yonge for any part of a business day.
Steve: Wait until next year when they try to run a bus bridge from Eglinton to St. Clair for over 10k/hour. Madness!
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A month ago, a 509 bus operator from Eglinton division told another passenger that streetcar service won’t resume on Queens Quay until at least December 2014. Frankly, I’m not surprised at the delay. The new tracks should be in the process of being placed by now for streetcar service early next year.
Steve: I am becoming very suspicious that the TTC is using this and other shutdowns as a way to reduce the number of streetcars they have to field, and that until the new fleet starts showing up, we are stuck with buses while blaming the delay on everyone else.
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It seems to me that the only thing the TTC can still do well is mis-managed approved projects (that is assuming they ever get that far).
Also, with all the discussion of a downtown relief line from Pape station, has anybody considered resurrecting Lower Bay Station. It seems to
me that when the University line was first built, it was envisioned to take some of the load off the section between Yonge/Bloor and Union.
And perhaps this would be a good interim solution until the whole downtown relief line gets resolved???
Steve: There is not enough track time free on the University line to handle trains from the Danforth subway as well as the existing service from the Spadina line. Not even with the new signal system.
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There was a sinkhole that opened up about a month ago at Rees and Queens Quay (which necessitated a bus detour onto Lake Shore) that I’ve been meaning to go and check out as from the Gardiner it looks like it’s still there, though it could be one of the regular construction pits. The track work seems to have stalled at HTO Park, possibly due to the sinkhole, which was supposed to have wrapped up along Queens Quay during this summer.
Steve: The only track work so far is the piece over the Peter Street slip which is a special construction for that bridge. Nothing else has been done yet.
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It is starting to look more and more unfortunate that they aren’t using this extended timeframe to expand the streetcar station at Union. Presumably that will be another extensive closure if/when they finally proceed with that.
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Not sure if this fits into this post so move/delete as you wish.
I noticed yesterday that the NextBus displays along King Street from Parliament to River (where no streetcars are running for about 8 weeks) now say STOP NOT IN USE. Certainly far better than only the handwritten paper signage – which is still there – and much better than having them say “Next Street car in x mins” – which they had been doing.
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Re the Yonge Subway closure – is the extended closure due to having to repair the tunnel liners? I recall mention of the tunnel liners on the North Yonge flattening at the top. This would be a separate issue from the ongoing asbestos abatement, and if it is the cause of the extended closure it should be made clear that the delay is due to the additional work having to be done.
Steve: As far as I know, this is the tunnel liner replacement project. The asbestos work was supposed to have been completed some time ago. I await info from the TTC regarding the extra year’s work on the liners.
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Steve, a streetcar operator mentioned to me a few months ago that he doubts the rollout of the new streetcars will occur in time for next year. He’s hearing that there are “many problems” with the new cars. With this in mind, I can see the TTC trying to “preserve” the existing CLRV fleet by keeping more cars in the carhouses today and “saving” them (holding off the first retirements) for at least 2-3 more years.
Steve: There are a lot of rumours among operators and some of them during the testing period I know to be false. However, delivery of “production” cars was supposed to begin in “fall 2013” with several cars arriving this year. I am going to chase the issue of when 4403, etc., will show up.
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Steve wrote:
Of course nobody will! That part of the Yonge line is only 60 years old, and everyone knows that subways last for 100 years. Why would there possibly be the need to make Yonge an exclusive transit street?!? 😉
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Steve,
What [about] the replacement of the service tracks on Eastern Ave leading into Russell carhouse? Seems to me this is the 2nd year in a row that this was supposed to happen and hasn’t.
Steve: Yes, this seems to have been pushed off another year.
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In response to Raymond Kennedy’s “Has the TTC EVER finished ANY project on time?”:
I’m no fan of the TTC but the track replacement at King & Spadina this past summer was bang on.
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Further to DavidC’s comment above – the TTC has now (today) put proper large printed signs into all the transit shelters on King from Parliament to River saying that the streetcars are on Queen (until November 28th). Let’s hope that this, rather late, burst of customer information is the start of a new policy or procedure for pre-arranged detours that are going to last for a while.
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Brad Ross’s own comment leaves the door open to even the December 2014 deadline being missed. Three months left in 2013, plus another 12 in 2014, adds up to 15 months. Eighteen months take us well into 2015. Given the rate of repair and inspection on the project, another two municipal elections might occur before it’s done.
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The project to replace the ladder track on Eastern Avenue is not going to get underway until after the new track installation on Leslie is substantially complete. This has more to do with placating the residents in the area who were quite vocal about having to endure two concurrent track projects so soon after the Queen East track replacement project was completed last year.
Steve: It is ironic that the Eastern Avenue project does not affect a residential street, but the area has been sensitized by the whole Leslie Barns project plus the endless work on Queen last year. The idea of combining Toronto Water and TTC track looks good on paper, but the TTC could have been out of there a lot faster if they didn’t have to sit and wait for the water project to get out of their way. It avoided two separate street shutdowns, but there was too much time when very little seemed to be happening, and the TTC took the lion’s share of the blame.
As far as the new streetcars are concerned, the testing at NRC in Ottawa is behind schedule. Until all 3 prototypes are thoroughly tested and back on the property, there can’t be a ‘green light’ for the production vehicles. Under the original schedule, six production cars were supposed to be delivered by year’s end – for a total of nine cars on the property – but this is not going to happen. On the bright side, this delay might be a good thing. Given the current administration’s hatred for surface rail, the last thing we need right now is to end up with another fleet of lemons – which unlike the TR fleet, anybody can spot if they start breaking down in service and tying up traffic.
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All these delays are courtesy of TTC Chair Karen Stintz and TTC CEO Andy Byford. It is time for a new TTC chair and a new TTC CEO.
Steve: You were not reading very carefully. The Queens Quay delays are primarily down to Hydro and the Ontario Energy Board, not the TTC. As for the North Yonge tunnel project, from what I hear, the length of this has been consistently understated since the project got underway, well before Stintz or Byford were installed. If Byford has a problem, it is with the quality of information he is given by his staff.
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Do you know the approximate duration of the aforementioned “extended” shutdown of the line between St. Clair and Eglinton for reconstruction of the roadbed from Muir to Berwick portal? Are rush hours and business days included in the shutdown? I thought that railways could maintain open-air roadbeds without much disruption. Why would this be any different for the subway?
Steve: It will be several weeks at least. The TTC really hasn’t figured this out yet. A major difference with mainline railways is that they usually don’t plan to pour a concrete foundation under the new track. Also, they generally don’t have to deal with power supply and as complex a signalling system in a relatively short piece of track. It’s not unusual for mainline railways to shut down one track while working on other parts of their line, an option that really doesn’t apply here.
All the same, it would be interesting to see a detailed explanation of the scope of work. From the long-standing slow orders north and south of Davisville, it has been clear for a few years that there are problems. Whether these could have been headed off with better maintenance, or if this is simply a case of the “100 year subway” wearing out early, is hard to say.
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Steve it appears that we had a forewarning of things such as this in the 90s by David Gunn who noted issues on north Yonge and the need to shut it down.
I assume this was what he was referring to in the 90s (state of good repair/tunnel issues) and is there any chance of a prolonged closure in your opinion of north Yonge to bring it up to snuff?
Steve: The problem Gunn was dealing with was the condition of the track which had reached a point where safe operation of trains was threatened. Work to rebuild the track had been on hold for years due to issues with asbestos in the tunnels. At that time, the problem with the tunnel liners had not yet been spotted.
An extended shutdown is not practical given the demand on the line, but I cannot help wondering why the TTC does not at least do Sunday shutdowns to get a longer work period.
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It will depend on who wants/needs to be the champion(s). In St. Clair’s case I believe that Caesar Palacio was the “councillor against” and Joe Mihevc the “councillor for” … who would have similar roles for Queen’s Quay (and south Spadina)?
And then of course there were the Save Our St. Clair folks and their court action. We’d need a similar group down at the Waterfront (maybe the BIA) who aren’t focused on the issue of island airport expansion.
Cheers, Moaz
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Wait is the TTC planning on pouring a concrete bed and bolting the tracks directly to it or will this section remain ballasted?
Steve: It appears that they are thinking of building a foundation. If it were just ties and ballast, it should not take weeks to rebuild the track and this sort of thing has been done many times all over the system. Far more information is needed about this project to explain why a lengthy shutdown is needed.
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Why did the council’s plan for a Scarbrough subway via McCowan not add a station at Eglinton and McCowan on the Bloor Danforth subway extension to provide a convenient transfer with the GO Lakeshore East line at Eglinton Station? I mean the trains are going underneath or extremely close to the intersection anyways, so why not? Also would it be any cheaper to NOT extend the Bloor Danforth subway but instead extend the Eglinton Crosstown LRT line along the council approved Scarbrough subway (i.e. completely underground from Kennedy and Eglinton and going to Sheppard and McCowan via McCowan)? I am sure the underground LRT plan I am suggesting will cost a lot of money but so will a subway and I am just trying to figure out if there might be a slighly cheaper option which will be just as fast.
Steve: The subway would turn north at Danforth Road, not at McCowan, to make a gentler curve. Any station would be over 1km from the GO station, and that is hardly “convenient”. As for through-routing the ECLRT, we have been down that path with the proposed Scarborough LRT which was originally to be through-routed with Eglinton. That option was rejected by the TTC because the demand on the Scarborough leg is expected to be almost double the demand on Eglinton. The same issue would apply to your proposal.
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A walk along QQ a few days ago showed precious little being done. Instead of work proceeding all along, with 50 to 100 workers, I counted only ten.
With regard to Yonge tunnel liners, I wonder to what extent the work train kit has been customized for the work. For a repetitive and long running task such as this, an expensive and specialized set up pays off in speed and minimizes service outage.
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Have they talked about what season they plan on redoing Muir to Berwick? If it’s early spring instead of winter, at least alternative options such as cycling would be available for many commuters. I’d hate to be waiting for a shuttle in January/February.
Steve: Midwinter construction is unlikely. This is the most difficult season to do any construction work. It is the heaviest period for TTC riding (thereby putting a strain on the bus fleet for regular service, never mind the bus shuttle around construction). A major storm during a winter shutdown is almost inevitable, and the resulting snarl would demolish the TTC’s credibility as a service provider just at the time when they are most needed.
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Unlike St. Clair the rebuilding of Queens Quay seems to be widely supported despite also involving the removal of car lanes. As a result the construction delays will probably be largely ignored.
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Re Young North early closure. This project began in May 2008 with a scheduled end date of “late 2010”. In January of 2011, the signs were changed to read “late 2012”. In December of 2012, they were changed again to read “late 2013”. This is 5 years of early closures. So much for Byford’s vow to improve customer service – or does that vow only apply to the downtown core? Given the figures in his e-mail, the project is only 40% complete in 5 years, (4000 or 10,000 liners checked) so it will take another 7 1/2 years to complete. That brings it to mid 2020. During this time anyone who lives north of Eglinton is required to be on the Bloor/Yonge platform well before midnight in order to get all the way to their station. (It is not unusual to arrive at Bloor/Yonge before midnight and wait for 2 or 3 minutes, then wait another 2 or 3 minutes at St. Clair, and go extemely slow through Davisville, ensuring that the train will go out of service at Eglinton after a 25 minute trip from Yonge/Bloor.)
Steve: The email is from Brad Ross, not Andy Byford, just for clarity.
How much is it costing the TTC to do this work, to run shuttle buses, to pay extra or over time to unionized employees, to pay shift differentials, to pay for gas for buses, to pay for more maintenance and cleaning? Is there actually someone in charge of this mess?
It is time for the TTC to do something about this situation. Early closing for 2 years, was a temporary situation. Early closing for 12 years is no longer temporary. Increasing costs and reduced services are causing those of us who are condemned to use the TTC major problems. We don’t have an alternative to public transit or the ability to turn down work that requires travel after midnight. We deserve better.
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Steve stated that the option of through-routing the ECLRT was rejected by the TTC because the demand on the Scarborough leg is expected to be almost double the demand on Eglinton.
I am not sure if this if this is correct. Of course if you force everyong off the SRT, then most will choose to transfer to the B-D Subway and not the ECLRT. However, if it is through-routed, then many more SRT riders will continue on to either; the future Eglinton/Don Mills stop on the DRL, or the Yonge-Eglinton Station, or the Eglinton West Station. I thought the Ford/Province compromise modelling from 2011 showed significant number of SRT riders would do just this and the ridership through the Scarborough stretch of Eglinton would not drop that much from the SRT values.
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Another delay. It would appear that this morning, TTC changed the date on the website for the resumption of 504 service on King between Parliament and Queen from November to February 1, 2014.
It only adds about 300 metres and 2 stops to the route, but traffic on Parliament is so constrained by all those long red lights at Richmond/Adelaide, that it easily adds 3-5 minutes to a trip at peak.
Probably not TTC to blame here. However the root cause of a lot of these delays is either City or Hydro. And if we look to some kind of solution, it would have to include them.
Steve: The work being done is the strengthening of the Don Bridge. This is a city project that has been put off repeatedly for the better part of a year. How much this contributed to the current condition of the King Street span I don’t know. It’s worth noting that there is a slow order on the east side of the main span that was fixed only a few years ago. The real question here is whether the bridge itself is in need of major repairs and what this will mean for services crossing the Don via Queen.
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Does anyone know if the Bay St streetcar tunnel destroyed due to second platform construction at Union will be rebuilt and if yes, then when is the streetcar tunnel set to be completed? Or are the streetcars going to come back to surface on Bay St? Will the new streetcar transfer with the subway at Union be an improved one? How much will a complete Queens Quay line east of Bay St cost and is there any hope of having it built anytime soon? One would think that such a line would be essential for the Pan Am Games and the Parapan Am Games but too much politics when it comes to making decisions about transit in Ontario.
Steve: The station and tunnel were not “destroyed”, only the access to them. Original plans were for service to return in February, but this has been put off to mid-year due to delays on the Queens Quay project.
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You are exactly right. If I am forced of a Scarborough RT or LRT, then I would choose the BD subway (unless the Eglinton Line was completely buried which unfortunately no hope of happening) but if the Scarborough RT or LRT line was part of the Eglinton Line, then I would carry on on that line (even if not underground) rather than switching to the Bloor Danforth as that would reduce the number of transfers I have to make. If the Eglinton Line is not going to be buried, then fine by me but please put the surface LRT on the south side of Eglinton around Leslie St and go underneath major intersections like Victoria Park, Pharmacy, Warden, Birchmount, and Kennedy just like you are going underneath Don Mills Rd and Black Creek Drive. I am not worried about the loss of car lanes but about the speed of transit and if it can be speeded up by grade separating as much as possible, then I am all for surface LRTs. Also please tunnel in the DVP area as well. An underground Leslie station is expensive in the short run but is worthwhile in the long run as there may be a major GO station there within the next 15 years and if you can’t put an underground station there, then at least put the LRT on the south side there (doesn’t cost a penny extra and makes both transit and cars faster). Can we not launch a petition on change.org or rootsaction.org or a Facebook group to have it moved to the south side?
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With the King closure from Parliament to River now extended through early next year, in an ideal world, we’d expedite the planned (2014?) King/Cherry intersection work, to avoid yet another closure of this piece of track next year.
An ideal world … I must be smoking something this morning …
Steve: It is unclear whether King/Cherry will be done before or after the Pan Am Games.
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I am not certain, but I would assume that these projects are large enough that the are Contracted out and not done by TTC forces. This takes away the lazy TTC worker excuse for the delays. I also assume that the Contractors are not unionized, so this takes away the lazy Unionized worker argument.
That leaves the problem being TTC management and project managers who are not on top of things. Before a project begins, they need to have agreement from all agencies and utilities on the timelines that the projects will be done. If Hydro did not receive their funding, then the project should not have started.
Steve: Some contractors are unionized, some maybe not. One problem with Hydro was that it was thought they would be able to make up the time, but that turned out to be optimistic. There is a hard stop on the end date for the project — the Pan Am Games. If they had not started when they did, it would have had to wait until 2016.
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