The TTC Board met on April 30, 2014. Items of interest on the agenda included:
- The CEO’s Report
- Purchase of Buses
- McNicoll Garage
- ATC for the Yonge University Spadina Subway
- Accessibility Plans
- Express Buses to GO Stations
- Service Increases and Improvements
TTC ridership continued to grow in early 2014 with annualized riding up 2.4% relative to the end of February 2013. For the first reporting period of 2014 (most of the month of January), ridership was below budget, but ran slightly ahead of budget in the second period (February). The harsh winter weather was the main culprit here, and the projected 2014 total ridership is now 538-million, down from 540m in the budget, but up from 525m in 2013.
In a long-continuing trend, the TTC’s revenue projection falls slightly short, even allowing for the lower ridership numbers, because more people are buying passes than anticipated in the budget. Expenses are under budget by a wider margin than revenue with the result that the TTC’s subsidy requirement is actually in better shape than planned. However, on the expense side, this is “largely due to the timing of certain non-labour and accident claims expenses” [page 5] and does not reflect the full-year’s results which are expected to be on budget.
Service punctuality numbers continue to be poor, although this was compounded by bad weather. As I have discussed here before, there are reasons to challenge even the reported numbers. The TTC is working on a new “Journey Time Metric” to better reflect actual rider conditions, but the details of its calculation and the results it produces have not yet been made public. (This is expected in the near future now that first quarter results are due to be released.)
Two streetcar services are specifically mentioned for poor performance. 511 Bathurst has suffered through a major water main replacement project that was suspended for the winter, but left parts of Bathurst Street with only a single useable lane. This work resumed in 2014 and is nearing completion. 512 St. Clair, a route that is almost entirely on its own right-of-way, suffered from “traffic congestion”. I inquired about this, and the problem lies in the narrow section from Old Weston to Keele Street. A study of widening the railway underpass here is now in progress by the City of Toronto.
51 of the 60 TR (Toronto Rocket) subway trainsets to replace the “H” series cars have been received from Bombardier. The TTC expects to retire the last of the H6 cars in June or July (details to be announced). A futher 20 trainsets are on order for the Spadina extension (10) and future service improvements (10).
The target arrival date for the first production car in the new streetcar order was today (May 2), but it’s not yet here. When asked, the TTC did not have a new target.
Although PRESTO will be rolled out on the new cars starting with the Spadina route, this will not occur until November 2014, and interim measures will be used for fare collection on this route. It is important to remember that hardly anyone will actually be using PRESTO on the TTC surface because it does not (yet) offer equivalent functionality to a Metropass, and it cannot be used on routes whose vehicles do not have PRESTO readers.
Meanwhile on the Leslie Barns project, the special work at Queen & Leslie that will lead to the new carhouse will be installed starting in late May. The actual date depends on completion of work on utilities that must be done before the track is installed. The full connection to the carhouse is expected to be in place by the end of 2014, with all works including the carhouse finishing in early 2015.
The TTC will purchase 55 new 40-foot low floor clean diesel buses for delivery in 2015 at a cost of $32.6-million. Original plans called for 12 buses for service improvements and 43 to operate the Scarborough RT replacement shuttle service. Current plans would see the RT stay open until the Scarborough Subway is completed, an uncertain matter pending the elections now in progress. Instead, the TTC plans to retire 52 old Nova high floor buses a year earlier than their planned 2016 date, and this order allows this to be brought forward into 2015.
These buses are at the end of their life, are becoming unreliable and are difficult to maintain, hence the preference for an early replacement.
What this illustrates is that the TTC will barely keep up with its aging fleet, never mind improve service, thanks to capital budget caps at the city and the end of the provincial bus purchase subsidy program.
This status report includes a presentation about the new garage proposed for northern Scarborough and accommodation of a growing bus fleet. Although the project budget is $181-million, only $80m is actually in the City of Toronto capital budget for this item. The remainder is part of the$2.7-billion backlog of unfunded projects.
The garage has been in the works for many years. When Transit City was announced, the garage project was put on hold because the opening of many new LRT lines would allow the bus fleet to be reduced in size even allowing for system growth. However, the combined effect of the LRT deferrals and continued ridership growth put the system already over capacity at its garages. The situation would have been even worse if not for the service cuts implemented by the Ford/Stintz team at the TTC that allowed a major bus purchase to be dropped from capital plans.
The TTC now faces the compound problem of needed more buses just to handle growth, plus a further need if crowding standards are to be improved back to the pre-Ford levels. Under current plans and funding, this is unlikely to be addressed for five years.
ATC for the Yonge-University-Spadina Subway
This report makes interesting reading because it sets out the long history of the Automatic Train Control (ATC) project for the Yonge subway (aka Line 1). An initial contract for $52-million has now doubled to over $128m. About $5m of the increase provides equipment for 20 TR trainsets that were not in the original order, but the majority comes from major changes in the scope and length of work for the project.
The situation is complicated by the presence of a parallel contract with a separate provider for the replacement of the original, 60-year old YUS signal system with new computer-based technology (referred to as CBI in the report). Installing two signal systems at the same time would be, putting it mildly, challenging because of the critical function signalling provides, let alone with two separate suppliers. Two systems (conventional signalling plus ATC) are being installed as a transitional measure, and so that trains and work cars that do not have ATC equipment can safely operate on the line (see page 2 of March 2012 report linked below).
The report sets out the project history, summarized below:
- September 2008: Contract awarded to Ansaldo (then Union Switch & Signal) for the replacement of the signalling on the oldest parts of the subway from Eglinton to Union including Davisville Yard ($14m). This work was expected to complete in June 2013, but due to “numerous technical problems and contractor performance issues”, this is now projected for October 2015.
- April 2009: Contract awarded to Alstom for ATC over the entire YUS and supply of ATC equipment for 60 TR trains ($58m). This contract did not include the Spadina extension to Vaughan.
- March 2012: Contract awarded to Ansaldo for the replacement of the existing signal system on the remainder of the YUS ($30m), provision of signalling for a test track at Wilson Yard ($3.2m), and the design and provision of a signal system for the Spadina extension ($27m).
- January 2013: Alstom contract amended to supply ATC for an extra 10 TR trainsets for the Spadina extension. (Approximately $2.5m)
- February 2013: Alstom contract amended for ATC over the Spadina extension. ($19m) The report notes that previous contract changes totalled $13m including the amount for the 10 trainsets’ ATC equipment. These changes are not detailed in the report. The contract was expected to complete at the end of 2016 with the opening of the extension.
- April 2014: Alsthom contract amended to provide ATC equipment for 10 TR trainsets recently approved for future service expansion, and for a major change of scope due to extension of the contract completion to 2020 (net increase $33m).
The major change in the 2014 report is that the complexity of installing, testing and converting to two new signal systems is greater than originally expected. The Spadina extension will open with a conventional system (the Ansaldo contract) and ATC will then be installed on top of this as is to be done on the existing line. The combination of delays in the Ansaldo project, delays in the completion of the extension, conflicting work needed on the existing subway (notably repairs to other aging infrastructure) and a more complex staging of testing and commissioning all adds substantially to the cost of the ATC contract (Alstom).
The April 2014 report notes:
Signal systems generally have an expected life of 25 to 30 years. [Page 2]
This is fascinating both because it is one more counterexample to the myth that subways last 100 years, and because the existing signal systems on the original Yonge-University and Bloor-Danforth lines are decades beyond the criterion stated here. One possible reason for their longevity is that the mechanical relay-based systems of the 1950s and 1960s did not become technologically obsolescent as quickly as “modern” computer-based gear. In any event, it is clear that new signalling is overdue on both lines.
The report also notes:
The minimum headway between subway trains operating under the existing signal system is 140 seconds. The ATC system will permit the headway to be safely reduced to at least 110 seconds. [Page 2]
That is a 27% increase in train throughput, somewhat less than figures claimed elsewhere for the future capacity improvement ATC will bring. As discussed in previous articles, very short headways are subject not just to the ability to run closely-spaced trains, but to move these trains through terminals and through busy stations quickly.
The new implementation schedule for ATC allows for various project delays, but pushes out the completion date to 2020. The TTC will have new TR trains on the property for improved service well before they can actually reduce headways and improve capacity.
This report sets out the TTC’s current plans for completion of system accessibility, but warns that this cannot be achieved without additional funding in the Capital Budget. (This is one of many “below the line” projects in the $2.7-billion unfunded capital backlog.)
Although the TTC sought reinstatement of provincial funding for accessibility, this was denied by the Minister of Economic Trade, Development and Employment, Eric Hoskins in a letter of April 7 in which he states:
“… the Government of Ontario does not provide funding to implement accessibility standards under the AODA. Flexibility is built into the requirements to give all public transportation service providers across the province the ability to come up with solutions that best meet their needs and those of their customers.”
He goes on to, in effect, tell the TTC that the regulations allow for a phased implementation and that they should simply build this into their financial plans. Of course, the TTC is the only system in Ontario with a subway and the need for complex retrofits into existing stations. The government’s position is rather odd considering the recent budget which proposed to shower money on the province.
Commissioner Heisey asked about the problems experienced at major stations with only one accessible path when an elevator is out of service (as it was recently at St. George for an extended overhaul), and whether the TTC would be better off to concentrate available funds on providing a second elevator at such locations rather than at stations with light usage. This matter has been referred to management and to the Advisory Committee on Accessible Transit (ACAT) for comment.
An obvious complexity is that at complex stations, this is not a matter of “one more” elevator, but of several to cover off various legs of the vertical journey. Bloor-Yonge has five, while St. George has two because it is a structurally simpler site.
This report responds to a Board request that staff review existing TTC express bus services for the possibility of adding stops where they could serve GO Transit stations. The stations involved are: Milliken, Eglinton, Guildwood, Agincourt and Old Cummer.
The report concludes that this would not be worthwhile because there is little market for transfer passengers due to the lack of fare integration and the limited service offered at some locations. Demand at GO stations from local routes is lower than demand at express stops, and this implies there is only a small market for access between TTC and GO services. The extra stops would be an “inconvenience” to more riders than they would benefit based on low projected demand, although the magnitude of the added travel time is not cited.
The real challenge for the TTC and for Metrolinx will be to make integrated trips more attractive both through frequent all-day services and integrated fares that do not discriminate against inside-416 riders.
Service Increases and Improvements
Chair Maria Augimeri proposed that staff report in June on the implications for capital and operating budgets of improving service levels on the bus and streetcar networks. The intent was to inform the 2015 budget process that will be underway through the fall and the debate that will inevitably follow about TTC funding by the new Council in 2015.
Staff were concerned about the date, and an alternative of August (the last month with a Board meeting before the municipal election) was proposed. However, former Chair and now Mayoral-candidate Karen Stintz objected that this was all a decision for the new Council and Board, and that the report should come forward in January 2015. It was clear that she resented a request for a report on a proposal that has been embraced by at least one of her competitors. The Stintz position passed 5-4 with the support of Commissioners Milczyn, Colle, Parker and Di Donato.
Chair Augimeri also asked for a report on the availability of buses during 2015 when there will be a construction moratorium and, hence, a lower need for supplemental bus services.
Commissioner Heisey proposed that staff work to reduce illegal parking in conjunction with the City and the Police citing a company, Shred-It, that routinely parks its trucks in the business district on main streets throughout the day and ignores parking tickets as a cost of doing business. This request in part duplicates work now underway by the City regarding improvements of downtown street operations.
I prefer a scorched-earth policy for these situations, and a fleet of heavy duty TTC tow trucks is just what Toronto needs. Businesses will only take this problem seriously when their equipment (and contents) are physically removed and the cost of flaunting parking regulations is prohibitive. Other cities don’t allow this sort of behaviour, while Toronto tinkers with changes in traffic regulations and ignores scofflaws.
Steve Munro 
So I see the North Yonge work has been extended to encompass 2015. Next up.. 2016 completion. Any word as to why the TTC has not opted for an extended closure rather than keep prolonging the work? If I am not mistaken the work has been ongoing since 2007!
Steve: It has been into 2015 in the budget for some time, simply not reflected in the public info. The problem with an extended closure is that the TTC would need at least two, probably three crews to do round-the-clock work and they would only be active on the weekend, a not particularly effective use of staff on an ongoing basis. Late night closures allow one crew. The work is far more extensive than originally thought because the number of tunnel liners to be repaired/replaced keeps growing (the condition is not evident until the sound insulation material is scraped off).
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If a business needs access that badly in the core there are loading areas. They can add a driver to drop and retrieve staff and materials from loading areas. Blocking a transit corridor should not be permitted. Lane exclusions also need to be vigourously enforced.
Steve: The city is supposed to be looking at formally marked loading zones as part of the Downtown Traffic Operations Study. However, the real need is for ruthless enforcement in areas where loading is not permitted. In the case of Shred-It, they are not “loading” in the strictest sense of the word, but conducting their business by illegally parking. It would as if a food truck set up shop on King Street all day long.
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The TTC needs to receive at least 12 new production streetcars BEFORE the end of August, for use on the Spadina 510 line. The current three prototypes would be kept as spares or backups. Each production vehicle has to be tested and send them through hoops, races, and other tricks before accepting them.
Likely we’ll see them shipped in a batch (to save on postage). Hopefully, not with a train of fuel tank cars.
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Does this mean “110 seconds or better” (i.e. 110 seconds or less) or “to a headway of at least 110 seconds” (i.e. 110 seconds or more)?
Steve: I believe that they mean that they will be able to get down to 110 seconds.
110 seconds is 32 trains/hour. That’s certainly at the limit for any subway system worldwide. At these headways, the limiting factor is the dwell time at the station. (The ultimate limit is dwell time + time to pull out of station + time for next train to pull in … and the latter two are functions of basic physics, so can’t really change).
Steve: Another constraint is at any location where train paths can interfere with each other, notably terminals and turnbacks, where the time for a train to clear shared track such as a crossover depends on track geometry, train length and acceptable G-forces at turnouts. There is also the small matter of crew response times both to signalling and to simply being on board and ready to leave a station when the route is clear. This will increase as a source of delay with one-man crews (who will have to walk the length of the train when reversing) unless TTC moves to a step-back crewing scheme.
As for illegal parking … if they are commercial vehicles, then the fine should double with each offense (with the count resetting every month or two). Sure, the first fine of $150 may be considered part of the cost of doing business, but the tenth fine of $153,600 probably won’t. The 20th fine of $157m would certainly deal with the worst offenders, possibly by bankrupting them.
Steve: It is the commercial scofflaws who are the worst because they treat fines as a cost of doing business. The only penalty they will understand is to have their “business” towed away.
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What a petty and shortsighted approach! This would be one of the most useful things that the current commission could accomplish. Her opponents ought to take her to task for this, as this more than anything else shows that she simply does not care about anything more than personal promotion.
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It’s been a while, and my memory may be faulty, but as best I recall the signalling system at Union Station was even older when they started replacing it – 70 years or more, I think. Relay-based control systems last fairly well; when I contracted at Hydro (admittedly nearly 20 years ago now), most of the protections were still relay-based (although they mostly only dated to ’64-’65) and there was no sense that they imminently needed to be replaced. (They were adding solid-state modules to existing protections where they needed repairs or extra functions, but not ripping entire existing protections out.) OTOH, I can certainly believe that anything solid-state will degrade to unmaintainability in 25 years. (My parents’ stove is older than I am; our 10-year-old stove has had 2 major control-related failures in the past 3 years.)
Here’s another vote for draconian parking enforcement; how do we make that happen? I’m sick of stupid delivery trucks blocking lanes on major streets at rush hour to drop off a dozen cases of pop for a convenience store!
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110-second headways will be touted as the way of the future, like the 30% fuel-saving hybrid buses, 50% more reliable new subway trains, quiet CNG buses, technologically superior H-6 subway cars, etc. The latest in a long list of transit myths and fairy tales.
We’ll hear a lot about the 110-second headways until it becomes apparent that real operations are nowhere near that level, just like all the items above.
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I had the chance to ride a TR with handles near the HVAC sections in April. Any date as to when all the TRs will have these new handles?
Steve: I have not heard anything about this moving into a full-scale retrofit, but will inquire.
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The TTC has presumably signed off on the final designs for the LFLRV’s if production deliveries are supposed to be arriving right now so the question is how long before Bombardier starts paying late penalties?
I’m also happy to see one of the commissioners bringing up the lack of redundancy in elevator service. I understand the issues with retrofitting existing stations but I think the TTC is making a big mistake by not building new stations with at least two elevator paths from street to platform. Preferably one at each entrance/exit.
On the matter of McNicoll Garage, I demand a moratorium on bus garages in Scarborough until downtown gets its fair share. Scarborough already has THREE while downtown has NONE. Do the math. It’s not fair for downtowners to be footing the bill for a FOURTH garage out in Scarborough while downtowners have to wait out in the cold because they have none.
Steve: Downtown has the Wheel Trans garage in the Port Lands. Why can’t you be happy with that?
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I would like to point out that Scarborough has 3 bus garages (Malvern, Birchmount and Eglinton), North York has 2 (Arrow and Wilson) and Etobicoke has 1 (Mount Dennis) because of the multitude of bus routes in the surrounding areas. The reason Russell and Roncesvalles are where they are is because of the proximity to 90% of all Streetcar routes in Toronto. If for example you had a Streetcar division out in Scarborough then the travel time to route would be horrendous.
That said, there are only 3 routes that would benefit from a division in downtown (65 Parliament, 75 Sherbourne and the 6 Bay). The 97 Yonge hardly ever comes downtown and could be better served by Wilson or Arrow.
The routes on the outer edge like the 31 Greenwood, 22 Coxwell and the 72 Pape are close enough to Birchmount Division to be handled by them.
Be that as it may however, where would you put a division in Downtown? The Portlands? With the Gardiner tying up traffic and the Pan Am games on the way.. there is little to no space left for a division anywhere near Downtown.
The reason they are all out in the middle of nowhere is because the land is cheap and the space is there. It’s the same problem that people are having now with the Coach Terminal, the traffic generated by all the buses plus the cost of the land is starting to get people thinking about building a terminal somewhere else and selling the land.
Steve: It was a joke, Richard! The downtown routes used to be served out of Davenport but it was a small garage and it made sense to close it. However, to continue in the same vein, Scarborough needs at least one streetcar barn.
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My version of “scorched earth” involves a court injunction which, if defied, sees Shred-It’s management locked up in jail for contempt of court.
Their behaviour is not only anti-social but poses a serious danger to the public. All for the sake of greed. Shameful!
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With regards to the McNicoll Garage, it looks like Chow’s plan for improved bus service may be DOA if she wins. On the other hand, the switch back to the LRT in Scarborough might free up the funding needed to get the project started.
Steve: If I were Transit Czar, I would say to TTC management, don’t tell me what you can’t do, tell me what you can do, and make it so ASAP. We seem to be able to do this with multi-billion dollar rapid transit projects, why not with buses? Of course the difference is that we would actually have to run the buses, not simply talk about ones that might arrive in 10 years.
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In answer to Dave,
Relay based signal systems are still in wide use, however on the old Yonge line, the old signal system is starting to become not reliable.
The wiring in the instrument cases has dried out and is very fragile. The wiring cannot be relied upon to last much longer and was identified to be replaced before issues arise.
The relays are very good but were made by a UK company no longer in business (SGE) The relay parts cannot be sourced; the relays are obsolete. Every mechanical trainstop and trainstop circuit controller has been replaced as the old ones were worn out and obsolete. The bulbs in the signals cannot be sourced.
The new CBI portion of the signal system will restore reliability and be maintainable.
The ATC portion will provide superior train control allowing reduced headways and other benefits.
Ray
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I could understand auto traffic being affected by “traffic congestion” in the narrow section under the bridge between Old Weston Road and Keele Street, but how could that affect 512 streetcar performance in the reserved lanes? That doesn’t seem to make sense.
Steve: I plan to pursue this further as I agree that if the problem is only at Keele Street, it should have been possible to maintain service elsewhere.
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I don’t understand how this narrow section affects the St. Clair streetcar. This section is still grade separated from traffic. The congestion does affect car traffic as two lanes converge to one lane, but the streetcars still can proceed at their own pace.
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In the winter, I talked to a driver on the 509 Exhibition bus, and he said that the buses start from a garage in Scarborough. So the buses have to drive down the DVP through traffic every morning, using up resources (driver time, vehicles) while not carrying any passengers. He said that the TTC didn’t give them enough time to get downtown (counting traffic), so service would always start late at the start of the day. In contrast the 63 Ossington buses started from a much closer garage than Scarborough.
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I was under the impression that the difference was also a lack of novelty oversized cheques, shiny shovels lifting small amounts of dirt only once in their existence, and ribbon cutting ceremonies.
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> 512 St. Clair, a route that is almost entirely on its own right-of-way, suffered from “traffic congestion”
Are you referring to 41 Keele? Traffic congestion on St. Clair between Keele/Weston and Old Weston definitely is a big problem for this bus route, but not for the streetcar which has its own right of way. This seems to be one of the biggest design flaws of the St. Clair streetcar (building a large big box shopping centre near here hasn’t helped).
It might help to permanently reroute this bus via Weston/Rogers and leave serving Old Weston Road to the 168.
Steve: No the TTC claims that the St. Clair car suffers from “traffic congestion”. As for 41 Keele, that’s another cock up with the intersection design at Old Weston Road. I don’t think this will be sorted out until the underpass is widened and that’s years away.
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Will the Nova RTS thus be retired before the Orion V’s? And what will the 55 new buses be (Flyers, Novas, etc)?
Steve: The report quite clearly states that the 55 new bus order is going to Nova.
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I would agree. I think I would also have a serious talk about management of headways, and running the full length of routes. As mayor, I would also have a weekly meeting with the TTC, traffic management, bylaw enforcement and Police, to review issues and projects with regards to route management, vehicle speeds, and issues in vehicle movements. TTC vehicles should not be waiting for long periods to execute turns that are known to be required. Look at projects required to allow streetcars and buses to hold in station awaiting correct headway, and to ensure that this was done.
Also should be asking what challenges current TTC bus routing posed for the other departments. Mullaly brought a much more open discussion within Ford, and that was what saved the company. I think the city could use a little more open discussion of what the issues are, and goal alignment between departments.
Roads, traffic management and transit need to be about moving people not vehicles. Policing needs to be about serving people first (“Serve and Protect”), thus they need to penalize those who are unduly slowing others, or acting unsafely. Blocking a lane of required road creates both an unsafe condition and undue delay. Police should issue the drivers proper warning, and then they can act on the basis of the operators ignoring a police order.
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It would make for great reality TV to watch a shredder truck get inserted into a giant shredder truck shredder. The city could make money on it too! Park it in a vacant lot and sell tickets to watch the destruction every day after the rush hour confiscations have been made. Then, unceremoneously, return the newly reconfigured vehicles to the head offices of the companies who owned them in a neatly placed pile (preferrably in the middle of their driveway shortly before they open in the morning). We can only wish.
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Personally, I prefer the Simpsons take on the idea. Naturally, the time involved should be much shorter and a bulldozer would be a more cost effective solution.
Unfortunately though, we all know the city won’t take the idea about keeping traffic lanes clear of parked vehicles seriously after the food truck debate.
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I would really like to know just where on earth they would put the swan boat pens.
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I have seen on several occasions trucks trying to make the south to west turn and get stuck with their front end over the nose of the median strip with one set of wheels on the car tracks and one on the road. Then they spend a lot of time going back and forth trying to get around this corner. Until they widen the underpass or the intersection throat they need to ban right turns south to east.
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Interim measures? I assume that the new streetcars will allow for cash fares so how would it be hard to allow for tickets and tokens?
Steve: There will be two ways to pay by cash or ticket/token. At major stops, there will be fare validators that will issue receipts (e.g. transfers). In the case of tickets, they will be imprinted with a time and location stamp (that’s why the new tickets are so much bigger — to make room). Otherwise, there will be onboard machines to do the same thing. It is possible that these will not be ready for the August 31 launch, but the TTC has not explained what the alternative fare validation/collection method will be.
Why? Nothing prevents the TTC from using the current three streetcars in actual operation right now if they wanted to. Once they are tested, they can be put into operation.
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Moaz: I agree that the overpass shouldn’t be a problem because cars don’t share it with streetcars. I’m wondering what the chances are that this might be a situation where “congestion” is being used as a “catch-all” excuse for something else. Or maybe the “congestion” is caused by cars waiting to left turn at Weston and Keele*. It would be interesting to see what an analysis of the GPS data shows.
Cheers, Moaz
*the only thing I can think of here is that Weston Road on the north side of the intersection is in a valley … Northbound drivers turning west onto St. Clair have to be extra careful because southbound cars were harder to see. This is even more challenging now because of the Stockyards building on the northwest corner. I wonder if these slow turns are delaying vehicle throughput in all directions at the intersection. M
Steve: See Robert Wightman’s previous reply in this thread.
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Moaz: My father always liked to tell a story of seeing illegally parked cars in Pakistan being picked up and carried away by forklifts.
Cheers, Moaz
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Funny … I thought drivers of southbound trucks on Weston bound for WB St. Clair would be sensible enough to use Gunns Rd. Perhaps the City should be putting warning signs on Southbound Weston Road starting from the intersection with Black Creek Drive.
Cheers, Moaz
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Steve has there a serious discussion of extending streetcar service further out? It would be great to have Streetcars running Kingston Road, east of Kennedy, especially in areas where it is wide enough to allow for a basic restricted right of way.
Steve: Several years ago there was talk about a Kingston Road LRT but this was due in part to the fact that the then local Councillor sat on the TTC (Brian Ashton). The incumbent is not interested in streetcars at all, and if anything happens here, which I doubt, it will be BRT or BRT-lite running into Vic Park Station.
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The 63 Ossington may be “much closer” to its garage – at one end of the route at least. However, I wonder why the TTC manages the rush hour to early evening transition by taking a bus out of service at the extreme south end. The transition often does not go smoothly and there are often 20-30 minute service gaps between 18:30 and 19:00. It seems to me that the last run south should either be eliminated or the bus should be in service going north. If demand is so great that the last run is needed southbound, then the bus should provide a service as it returns north. While Ossington offers frequent service (except for the gaps) the crowding is not acceptable during many periods.
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That is too bad, BRT could be great, but some interconnectivity other than just with subway would be better to weave Scarborough into Toronto, and Streetcar seems to give a level or permanence that bus just can’t.
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Robert Lubinski wrote:
On a related note: Now that the TRs have been in service for some time, has anyone checked to see if they are attaining the 10% increase in passenger capacity as claimed?
Steve wrote:
This goes back to the whole issue of “TTC culture” — this is part of it. For a variety of reasons, it seems as though there is a culture of looking at proposals and finding reasons why they won’t work. What the TTC needs is to promote a culture of finding a way to make things work. Start with low-cost, low-risk measures that can be reversed if they don’t work — the passenger redirection during the AM peak on the Bloor platform is a good example of a low-cost pilot that was found to have a measurable benefit and was kept in place (also: a seemingly rare example of the TTC exhibiting innovation and a “can-do” attitude).
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Moaz, I was talking about Old Weston Rd and St. Clair, not Weston Road and St. Clair. This intersection has a very sharp turn into a very narrow road lane.
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One thing I found rather interesting in Melbourne, if not convenient, was that their trams would run in revenue service back to the depot (carhouse). They would display a route number of “00” with a destination of the name of the depot. This makes for some possible one-seat trips that would ordinarily require a transfer or two.
I also noticed in Pittsburgh, when buses were out of service and heading back to the garage, they would have a destination sign with the name of the garage they were heading to. I believe these were deadhead moves, so the specific destination sign (instead of “garage” or “not in service”) seems rather meaningless.
Steve: Streetcars are supposed to make trips to/from the carhouse in service, but buses dead-head because they are following less predictable routes, and it saves running time (and money).
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What size of bus does this route currently run? Also why would you pull a bus out of service rather than returning North? I would have thought in the evening rush that would be the primary flow.
Steve: This route operates with standard 40-foot buses.
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Moaz: That explains it. I suppose that at that location there isn’t much of a solution until the road is widened.
Cheers, Moaz
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<blockquote>Malcolm N said:
Steve has there a serious discussion of extending streetcar service further out? It would be great to have Streetcars running Kingston Road, east of Kennedy, especially in areas where it is wide enough to allow for a basic restricted right of way.
In addition to what Steve said, the problem is that there is no room for a private right of way basically west of Birchmount on Danforth Ave or Kingston Road. As a result, you would have to use street running to reach Victoria Park station, or a lot of tunnelling and expropriation, and the TTC doesn’t like that idea.
At best, you might be able to make a case for extending the 502 & 503 to Cliffside.
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As Brent sent low cost sensible solutions. AND EVEN THAT. TTC can’t get right. Train count went from 20 to 30 trains in 36 days, and now back down to 25 trains.
Working with the proposal innovator would have created 30 to 35 trains hourly.
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Let just replace all TTC staff with us bloggers. We have passion to fix and improve transit. TTC lack respect for taxpayers and passion to making transit work well. I like Steve’s comment: “why can’t you do it?” People with transit passion never take no for an answer.
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You are right west of Birchmount it would have to run on street. If you did get a streetcar as far as Birchcliff and Kingston road, it would be a short hop to an area where it would be viable to do a restricted ROW. I do not believe it is the end of the world to have it go through some areas on street.
I believe that developing a basic network of streetcar network within Scarborough, tying it back to the subway at Kennedy and linking the STC with the busiest bus routes redone as BRT or streetcar in ROW could hugely improve transit within Scarborough, and create a better sense of it being part of Toronto.
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