TTC 2017 Operations: A Budget Meeting With No Budget (Updated)

Updated September 22, 2016 at 11:30 am: Information from the Budget Committee meeting has been added. It is organized by topic so that readers do not have to wade through the meandering nature of a discussion that lasted a few hours.

Fare Evasion:

This topic came up early in response to a deputation from TTC Riders. Commissioner Byers asked whether money could be saved by reducing evasion. TTC management claims that the numbers remain low, but later came to acknowledge that increasing the fare inspection from 80 to 100 would be beneficial. The committee requested that this be addressed in the overall budget.

For reference, a fare inspector costs the TTC at least $100k/year including benefits, and so 20 more would represent an increased operating cost of at least $2 million. Fare revenue stands at about $1.1 billion, and a 1% change in fare recoveries (either way) is worth about $11m annually. The TTC would like to get the fare evasion rate down to 2% or less.

CEO Andy Byford noted that the intent of inspection is to make the chance of being caught and the penalty for this both high enough that few attempt to evade fares. Inspection will actually become more labour intensive with the shift to Presto because the cards must be scanned to determine whether a fare has been paid, while transfers and Metropasses can be quickly checked visually.

Service on Lightly Used Routes

Commissioner Byers also asked whether there were savings to be had by cutting service where buses were running “empty”. This is a complex issue for several reasons.

Before the TTC returned to guaranteed full service on all routes (a John Tory initiative to reverse one of Rob Ford’s cuts), a standard was developed to screen out the worst performers. The metric used was riders per vehicle hour, and the value was set at 10. In other words, if there are two buses on a route, they must carry at least 20 riders per hour between them. Note that these riders are not on the buses all at the same time, but the loads will often be concentrated in location and direction. This leaves the bus running “empty” some of the time.

Many routes have outer edges and branches that do not achieve the same level of demand as the core part of the system. If one were to look only at these sections, one could prune the “poor performing” bits around the edges. However, this would leave major routes operating on a shorter extent than during “normal” hours, and the degree of cutback would vary from place to place. This is a recipe for riders abandoning routes because they are unsure of when service will be available, or that they might miss the “last bus” for a trip home.

Without question, riders on these segments are carried at a higher cost, but that is part of the cost of doing business on a network. One might also add that there is a double standard where it is acceptable to subsidize riders on a subway line at a very high rate, while decrying the “waste” of such an expense on a bus route.

This issue comes up regularly, and there is an underlying implication that vast amounts of public money are wasted where service is not required. The actual numbers tell a very different story.

When the full service to all routes was restored, the cost to do so was pegged at $1.7m for the partial year implementation in 2015, and at $5.5m for the projected full year cost in 2016. This shows that the amount of money available if the policy were reversed is marginal unless the standard for “poor performance” is set much higher and correspondingly more service disappears.

Provincial Subsidy

Commissioner Mihevc raised the perennial question of getting more money from Queen’s Park as an alternative to higher fares, taxes or service cuts. In doing so, he is longing for an era over two decades ago when Ontario paid 50% of the TTC’s operating subsidy, an amount that would roughly have been $305m in 2016. The actual subsidy from Queen’s Park is about $90m which comes from the Provincial Gas Tax allocated to the City of Toronto (a further $70m from this source goes to the Capital Budget).

Queen’s Park might be forgiven for wondering whether any new transit cash would actually improve the TTC’s lot, or simply be used to reduce City expenses and preserve lower property taxes and/or fares. Recent sleight-of-hand in the Capital Budget where nearly $1 billion of proposed expenditures simply vanished from the books, thereby neatly providing the City’s “contribution” to a shared federal-municipal funding scheme at no cost suggest that senior governments are right to distrust municipal intentions.

Mihevc claimed that the subsidy per rider was higher under Mayor Miller. The actual numbers appear in the chart below. Miller’s last budget year was 2010. Note that except for 2008, the provincial gas tax contribution has remained constant, but on a per rider basis is declining due to growth.

20002015_subsidyperrider

Where Is The Additional Service?

TTC Riders observed that people at a Jane-Finch community meeting laughed when told that the TTC had increased service. The problem here is that the service adds vary by time of day and location, and not all riders benefit equally. There is also the discrepancy between advertised and actual service as I have discussed in other articles.

The following are changes in the Jane-Finch area between September 2014 (pre-election) schedules and those in use today:

                2014       2016

35 Jane
AM Peak         5'00"      4'45"
M-F Midday      8'00"      6'15"
M-F Evening     11'00"     10'00"
Sun Morning     11'00"     10'00"
Sun Afternoon   10'30"     10'00"

195 Jane Rocket
AM Peak         10'30"     10'00"

36 Finch West
AM Peak         3'00"      3'37" * 
M-F Midday      5'00"      5'20" *
PM Peak         3'34"      4'37" *
M-F Early Eve   7'15"      7'45" *
M-F Late Eve    7'30"      9'20" *
Sat Early AM    9'00"      9'30"
Sat Morning     6'30"      6'00"
Sat Afternoon   5'30"      4'30"
Sat Early Eve   9'00"      8'00"
Sun Early AM    10'30"     10'00"
Sun Morning     6'45"      6'30"
Sun Afternoon   5'30"      5'00"
Sun Early Eve   9'00"      7'15"
Sun Late Eve    11'15"     10'00"
* Changed from regular to articulated buses on 36A Humberwood service.

Saving 2.6 Percent

Roughly two thirds of the $15.8m savings cited by TTC management came from reduced Health Care costs. The reason cited for this is that the ongoing investigations into Benefits Fraud have resulted in lower claims. This effect will bottom out at some point, and so further savings in 2018 cannot be counted on.

In a “normal” year, the $15.8m would have been part of the overall budgetary review, but because of the Council request for an across the board 2.6% cut, these have been separately identified. What has not yet been addressed is the remaining $172m shortfall between the City subsidy and the TTC’s projected needs.

Saving $172 Million

TTC management has a long list of requirements totalling $172m, although they continue review of their budget to see if added savings can be found that do not affect service quality. Andy Byford strongly made the point that he does not plan to cut service. We will have to see what Council and the TTC Board actually direct him to achieve.

The 2016 budget provided for service improvements in September 2016, but these are not required according to the TTC because ridership is lower than anticipated. There has been no public review of actual loading conditions and whether there are routes requiring more service. A common problem is that for peak service the TTC has no spare vehicles, and so budgeted improvements could not be implemented even if the loading standards showed they were required. In years past, the TTC would list the improvements that could not be made due to various constraints (typically fleet, budget and availability of operators), but this list has not been published recently.

Much of the “savings” against the originally foreseen $215m budget pressure does not arise from management actions. The delay in Presto rollout is laid at the feet of that agency (see below), and the saving is simply a case of delaying the onset of the more expensive period where TTC and Presto fare collection systems and staff co-exist. The draw from the “stabilization reserve” (surplus subsidy from past years that was not required) will exhaust this reserve in 2017 even though 2018 is expected to be a difficult budget year too.

TTC management often cites “savings” in diesel fuel costs through hedging, and claims an $11m saving for 2017. The total fuel budget for 2016 was $84m, itself down almost $10m from 2015. How much of this reduction is simply a question of market pricing and how much comes from hedging is not broken out. One is a management tactic while the other is simply good fortune that would be reversed if fuel costs go up again. Indeed, this saving will be offset in 2017 by carbon taxes.

The problems with Presto arise from two issues:

  • Presto’s IT provider (Accenture) has not yet provisioned sufficient back-office computing power to handle the volume of transactions that Metropass sales will generate. This is being remedied, but will delay the rollout.
  • The delivery of fare media vending machines from Presto is running late, and station collector staff cannot be reduced/redeployed because they will continue to sell legacy media.

Commissioner Myers described Presto as a “mini Bombardier” in their inability to deliver a product on time. It would appear that Presto faces a similar problem – the lack of investment in sufficient capacity.

Long Term Savings

The TTC is midway through many changes in how it does business such as the replacement of its archaic vehicle monitoring system and the implementation of computer systems using modern, integrated software. These are expected to produce savings once completed, but there is a short-term hump while changes are developed and implemented.

The Committee asked management to produce a report listing all of the projects together with their projected costs and savings so that short-term funding increases can be justified as “investments” in future savings. The Catch-22 here, of course, is that those savings will have to actually materialize. A more common situation is that new systems and procedures allow improved or expanded functionality and service, part of the justification for undertaking them, but do not necessarily reduce costs.

Collective Bargaining Agreements

The current agreements run into 2018 and bind the TTC to cost increases. In preparation for the next round of negotiations, they will continue to examine ways to reduce costs, but this issue is not debated publicly unless it explodes into the media from specific proposals.

How The Budget Works

Commissioner Campbell is frustrated by the way in which the budget is presented, notably that it shows previous year budget figures, not actual results, as the basis for comparison. One problem here is that work on “next year’s” budget often starts before “last year’s” numbers are finalized, but more generally this is an issue with municipal budgets generally. The use of previous budgets as a starting point is not a problem if budget and actual numbers do not vary by much, but this can be thrown off by unexpected revenue or cost changes.

Moreover, Council is always wrestling with amounts at the margins. For example, the TTC subsidy is almost $500m, but a 1% change in the gross costs (the full budget, not the net after fares and other revenue) amounts to about $17m, equivalent to roughly a 0.6% property tax hike. Moreover, if that $17m were to be entirely recovered through subsidy, it would represent a 3.4% increase on that $500m base sending the budget hawks screaming about “out of control” costs.

Ridership

Ridership changes occur at different rates both by time of day and by location. The overall numbers appear in the monthly CEO’s Report, and a current issue is whether the downturn will be sustained or if it is a short-term effect. Ridership for 2016 is up slightly over 2015, but not by the amount originally forecast.

This is an underlying problem with TTC budgets. At times, simply to produce more revenue on paper and thereby reduce the “required” subsidy, the TTC has aimed high for ridership. Many times, they got away with this, but the tactic failed in 2016. The shortfall (as the numbers above show) represent large percentage hits relative to the subsidy and this creates a funding crisis thanks to overly optimistic projections. Conversely if the TTC aims low, but does better than expected, it is criticized for demanding too much.

Commissioner Mihevc observed that an 8 million drop in projected ridership came with a projected revenue loss of $32m, or $4 per ride. Management explained that there was actually an offsetting additional 4m free rides by children meaning that for paying customers, the shortfall was actually 12m rides at a cost of about $2.65 each. This value is still higher than the average fare paid, and the discrepancy has not been fully explained.

The modal share is growing downtown, according to Deputy CEO Chris Upfold, but falling elsewhere. The boundaries of this effect were not discussed, and we will not have a detailed look at the issue until the 2016 Transportation Tomorrow Survey reports out sometime next year. (This is a quinquennial survey conducted by the University of Toronto for the Ministry of Transportation and many other agencies/cities.)

Problems with capacity arise from a lack of sufficient fleet to carry riders coupled with the ongoing effects of service delays and interruptions. For example, service capacity on 504 King is planned to be substantially improved, but this will require a fleet of new low floor streetcars.

TTC management routinely cites employment stats as the closest indicator of ridership. However, this number is affected by many factors including:

  • Core area jobs tend to have conventional hours and produce the well known peak travel effects on transit.
  • Off peak workers and those located outside of the core face the double challenge of lower service levels and a network that is not oriented to their travel requirements.
  • Many jobs are now part time, and more trips are required for a worker to get between them.

Off-peak service levels and reliability can work against making transit attractive for many outside of the core because of long travel times and transfer connections at inhospitable locations.

The Budget Committee appeared to be interested in more details about the times, locations and causes of demand changes, but did not actually pass a motion to this effect. Chris Upfold remarked that the drop has not been concentrated in specific times and locations (although this contradicts an earlier comment about modal share), and that the TTC does not have the technology to track riding in detail. This begs the question of how they track riding at all, and what data they do have on route behaviour.

Wheel-Trans

Wheel-Trans is a large growth area in the TTC’s budget thanks to several factors:

  • 12-13% increase in basic demand.
  • 5% increase in demand due to new eligibility criteria.
  • Improved call centre performance means fewer calls are abandoned and more rides are booked.
  • The unaccommodated rate (requests that got through, but could not be booked) has dropped from 2% to under .5%.

Chair Josh Colle would like to see Queen’s Park contribute to the cost of Wheel-Trans given that it is provincial legislation driving some of the growth. Given that transportation is considered as a human right, this is a cost that must be widely absorbed just as businesses deal with the cost of accessibility and accommodation. For several years, the TTC held its elevator program hostage to demands for more provincial funding, but that charade ended in 2016 when the Easier Access program moved back into the “funded” part of the Capital Budget.

Toronto faces additional costs, and it’s time for Council to accept the responsibility.

Commissioner Campbell moved that staff report on the option of letting registered WT users ride for free on the conventional system so that at least some trips might be diverted. This gets into a difficult territory of the general problem of groups who ask for reduced TTC fares, a population substantially larger than the WT community. This really should be dealt with as part of the City’s overall review of subsidy programs, not as a one-off scheme to avoid WT costs at the TTC.

The original post follows below.

The TTC Budget Committee will meet on September 21. At this point, we have only the most threadbare of reports that gives no indication of how transit service will survive the onslaught of Mayor Tory’s misguided and reckless attitude to funding TTC service.

The report is a mere six pages.

In order to give the impression that TTC management actually are achieving the cuts Tory wants, they have “found” some loose change to meet the 2.6% reduction in operating subsidy.

2017_opsbtwodotsixred

This saving is achieved by the following projected budget line reductions:

  • Remove land lines for TTC staff who are provided with cell phones ($0.3m)
  • An increase in capital projects in 2017 will cause a higher proportion of some staff costs to be charged to capital rather than operating ($0.8m)
  • Reduced budget for departmental overtime so that increased rates due to the collective agreement are absorbed within departmental budgets ($0.8m)
  • Reduced training and travel ($0.5m)
  • Reduced stand-by costs ($0.6m)
  • Materials and supplies costs reduced by: increased bus warranty recoveries, converting IT contractor positions to staff, reduced furniture and equipment budget. ($1.0m)
  • Deferral of the September 2015 service increase translates to a saving in full year costs to continue these improvements to 2016 ($1.5m)
  • Lower health care costs due to a downward trend in claims ($10.3m)

Most of the saving ($15.4m) actually occurs on the regular TTC side of the house with only $0.4m as lower Wheel-Trans costs. This is a simple case of the relative size of the two organizations and the tiny amount of infrastructure (beyond buses and a garage) that must be maintained out of the W-T budget.

These numbers are troubling on a few counts:

  • Several of these are one-time improvements that will not necessarily be repeated in future years. For example, a reduction in capital work (or an increase in day to day “operations” maintenance charges) would shift staff costs back to the Operations side of the ledger.
  • The reduced health care costs and the service deferrals are not “management” actions to trim costs, but rather they are windfalls that landed in the TTC’s and hence the City’s lap. Service will eventually have to be improved, and costs will rise, especially when the Spadina subway extension (TYSSE) is fully opened.

Readers unfamiliar with TTC budgets should remember that the numbers above are only a reduction in the subsidy, not in the total budget which stands for 2016 at about $1.7 billion. That is where the much more difficult problems lie.

The TTC still faces very large pressures in its cost base, and by comparison, the 2.6% cut is trivial. The following list, totalling $215 million, was published earlier this year and is repeated in the preliminary budget report.

  • On a budget-to-budget basis, and with no assumed fare increase, passenger revenue will be $32m lower in the 2017 budget than in 2016 due to lower than expected ridership growth.
  • Wheel-Trans costs will ride by $31m due to strong ridership growth and AODA changes.
  • Start-up costs for the Spadina extension are pegged at $7m.
  • Presto costs are projected to be $30m.
  • Contracted wage and benefits costs will rise by $25m and $11m respectively.
  • Replacement of hybrid bus batteries and increased rail vehicle maintenance will cost $25m.
  • Accident claims and general inflation will add $8m.
  • Energy costs will rise by $15m of which $5m arises from cap-and-trade costs.
  • Other increases total $30m.

Since this list was issued, further savings and possible revenues have been identified:

  • Presto fees will be reduced from $30m to $14m due to a later phasing out of legacy fare media than originally planned.
  • Energy cost increases have been reduced from $15m to $4m due to lower diesel fuel costs.
  • The TTC proposes a $15.4m draw from the “stabilization reserve”, a City account that holds budgetary surpluses from past years.

This would reduce the outstanding shortfall to $172.6m, still about 10% of the overall budget. There is no indication in the report as to how or if this will be achieved:

Options for addressing this will be developed and provided as part of the formal budget presented to the TTC Board later this fall. [p. 5]

We have no sense of the scale of service reductions or maintenance cuts or fare increases/changes that such a revenue loss would require. This is a point where we must ask whether the TTC is hiding this information from public debate lest it embarrass Mayor Tory too extensively, or in some vain hope that the Tooth Fairy and a whole squad of Leprechauns with Unicorns drawing wagons laden with pots of gold will appear out the the blue.

Staff continues to review all elements of the budget to identify reductions in these pressures that do not affect service. [p. 5]

That’s a tall order for a reduction on this scale.

This report claims that the TTC has met the -2.6% target for its subsidy, but only by ignoring a herd of elephants in the room and a $172m shortfall. The three “savings” recently identified are all windfalls and do not represent active management of TTC costs. Indeed for several years, the TTC has quoted a high cost for diesel fuel in their budget only to find “savings” later when the price is lower than anticipated.

And so we will have budget meeting with no budget, no sense of what will be needed going into the City’s budget round this fall. How the TTC Board can take any sort of informed position is mind-boggling, but that’s what we get from this Board. They should be demanding more information, but they cannot bring themselves to demand clear answers from staff.

The Ford-Stintz era at the TTC was all about sunny, bright good news meetings. Tory and TTC Chair Colle profess a concern for transit, but cannot bring themselves to actually address the basic funding problems.

Big announcements for capital projects we cannot afford, while the basics of transit are thrown to mad curs who pass themselves off as budget watchdogs. This is an utter abdication of responsibility.

53 thoughts on “TTC 2017 Operations: A Budget Meeting With No Budget (Updated)

  1. Fairness Please posted:

    Road tolls are okay to fund road construction/repairs but NOT transit. Transit fares should fund transit construction and operation. […] It’s not okay to make drivers pay for transit that they will never use just like it would not be okay for Toronto taxes to pay for say library construction in Brampton – a library that Torontonians will likely NEVER use. It’s about fairness – would you be willing to pay my grocery bill and if not, why should drivers pay for transit that they will never use?

    Because there are social goods other than the direct ones. That is why I have to pay school taxes even though I have no children.

    But there is an obvious direct benefit to drivers of a well-functioning transit system. Did you try to drive in Toronto during the last transit strike? If not, ask someone who did just how easy it was to get around when there was no transit to remove cars from the road.

    Drivers may not use transit, but they benefit from it directly.

    Like

  2. CNB: TTC driver speaking.

    Every time I see the claims of low fare evasion rates, I laugh. The ones that evade fares habitually know not to try it on streetcars, they take the bus to the subway and grab a transfer there so they look legitimate. Rates are at least double what TTC management thinks. Example. The worst route out of my garage has anywhere up to 10 people per HOUR who are “short today”, or “forgot to get a transfer”, or “will pay at the station”, or or or. I’ve counted a few times, just for my curiosity. Now, that’s cash fares only, so bump it up for fake passes and tokens, and then again for folks that started on another bus, or walked in through the bus driveway. Fare evasion rate on that route is significantly into the double digits. [… remainder of quote clipped for brevity]

    Thank you for sharing with us your personal experiences as a driver. I think that TTC drivers should also get a say in TTC policies through vote. Also since you encounter the same customer again and again making death threats against you, why do you not record it and then call the police? Do the TTC security cameras record voice? If not, then you will need to make sure that you record the voice as well. I also agree with you that the TTC needs more fare inspectors but they are very expensive to get.

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  3. Fairness Please said: Road tolls are okay to fund road construction/repairs but NOT transit. Transit fares should fund transit construction and operation. It’s not okay to make drivers pay for transit that they will never use.

    You are missing the fundamental connection between congestion and transit. The more people use transit the more space there is on the road for those who do not use transit. For example, in London applying a congestion charge to 8% of vehicle-km, there was an overall reduction of traffic volume by 11% and in increase in average speed of 22% (from 2003 to 2007). If you aren’t investing the road tolls in transit, what do you expect people to do?

    Fairness Please said: Property tax is not a “wealth” tax – it is a tax collected to fund services.

    Property taxes are a “wealth tax” in that they are a tax based on total net worth and not total earnings, which dictates ability to pay.

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  4. CNB wrote: The problem is, when TTC drivers call in to report fare evasion… head office doesn’t care.

    That must be why one driver I know tells me he just goes on the on-board PA and says,

    “Attention fare-paying passengers. This gentleman/woman now boarding wishes to board without paying a fare. Let me know by a show of hands if I should refuse this request.”

    🙂

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  5. Within the local community property taxes are based on assessed value. This does mean that properties that are “worth more” also “pay more”. However, within one community the value of a property is a rough approximation of the cost of servicing that property and its inhabitants. (Generally I don’t favour property taxes and I agree the approximation is not always fair.)

    Where the relationship between property value and property taxes does not hold up is when a comparison is made between two different communities. This mistake (by Toronto Star et al) is frequently made by comparing a $500,000 house in Toronto and (for example) Oshawa. In this case the property in Oshawa would be much larger and have more bedrooms. Using the same “rough approximation” it is fair that the Oshawa house should pay more.

    In order to compare the property tax rate between Oshawa and Toronto, one would need to look at comparable houses in comparable areas of the City. A two bedroom bungalow in an area without good transportation would be about $500,000 in Toronto. (See recent examples in Torontoist). A similar property in Oshawa would likely be worth less but pay more actual dollars in tax. This is the comparison that would show how much lower Toronto taxes are than the comparable community.

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  6. “Fairness” attributes to Michael Forest something I wrote.

    I agree that in-house or contracted out, there’s a hierarchy of supervision. Certainly garbage collection operated by the City has City supervisors.

    The point is, in any contract, we are paying for the contractor’s supervision hierarchy as part of the contracted service. Then if we add our own supervision hierarchy to make sure the contractor’s supervisors are supervising correctly, now there are two supervision hierarchies. That’s going to cost more than one hierarchy.

    As a related point, you can’t point to the money paid via the contract and claim that that’s the net cost of delivering the service via contracting. You have to include all the people you now have on your end who do nothing but write, review, and audit the contracting documents and work performed. This is a big pile of overhead. I bet it’s usually not included in the “we can contract garbage/transit/whatever out for $XXX” statements that politicians like to make.

    Steve has made this point relating to 3P contracts, as favoured by Metrolinx. There’s lots of overhead on Metrolinx’ end to develop the contracts, to go through the contracting process, and then monitoring the contractors’ performance. Once you include the Metrolinx staff dedicated to this otherwise unnecessary process, are you really ahead, either financially or in the timeline of actually getting something done?

    Steve: A comment that has been made during discussion of 3Ps, including by Metrolinx, is that this process adds about a year to the length of a large project because so much of what would simply be routine business practices if done in house must be specified so that a contractor can be held to account.

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  7. A nameless municipality hired a new engineer and he drew up plans to rebuild a road I use up there. He wanted the new road to have 20 cm of asphalt and that is what he put in the spec. A contractor bid on it and was awarded the contract. He promptly put 20 cm of asphalt on top of the original road. The engineer said you didn’t redo the base. The contractor said it wasn’t in the contract; all you asked for was 20 cm of new asphalt which you got. The engineer said “you didn’t redo the shoulders” to which the contractor replied “it wasn’t in the contract.” Have you ever tried to get out of a driveway when the road surface is 20 cm higher than you driveway?. It isn’t easy. I think that there will be a opening soon for a town engineer.

    Contracts must spell out exactly what you want done or you will end up with a brand new 20 cm thick layer of asphalt over and old worn out road. This is going to need replacing very soon.

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  8. DavidAH_Ca:

    Because there are social goods other than the direct ones. That is why I have to pay school taxes even though I have no children.

    But there is an obvious direct benefit to drivers of a well-functioning transit system. Did you try to drive in Toronto during the last transit strike? If not, ask someone who did just how easy it was to get around when there was no transit to remove cars from the road.

    Drivers may not use transit, but they benefit from it directly.

    Cmon… School taxes and road tolls are not a comparable.

    Forcing commuters out of lanes and reserving these lanes for the wealthy is shameful.

    Roads are and will continue to be the backbone which allows commuters outside the core to get from point A to point Z in our transit reality in this Province. As there are currently no other good options except for those that live within Toronto’s core transit island. Tolling also has a large infrastructure and bookkeeping cost associated with it compared to a much simpler property tax.

    If we are are going to tax to grow a public transit network than the tax should be on property so the majority pay just like school tax. Don’t penalize commuters lives from outside the core who are trying to make a living or make it hard for those of lesser means.

    Many here around this blog complain about overcrowding enough this exclusive local transit network. They should just be happy that drivers are still needed until we grow the infrastructure for others to use.

    I’m all for taxing everyone to build, expand and operate a fair network this City and Province, but targeting specific groups of people is not the way to go about it. Our Politicians have dithered on transit for so long we now think it’s normal to draw up polarizing solutions which actually don’t solve anything in the reality of the big picture.

    From all sides of this discussion there is enough lack of consideration and understanding towards differing ways of life from inside and outside the core of the City to the 905. We don’t need to be creating further divides which don’t even address the real problem.

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  9. Robert Wightman wrote: Contracts must spell out exactly what you want done or you will end up with a brand new 20 cm thick layer of asphalt over and old worn out road. This is going to need replacing very soon.

    That is one possibility, but there is another outcome that occurs far too often…

    Contractors (at least good ones) know just what it takes to get a job done and when they see missing details in the specifications, they put in a low-ball bid.

    Why do this? So they can get a job that they know will require all sorts of change orders in order to complete, and THAT is where they make their money.

    The more complete and specific the specifications are, the less room there will be for change orders. I learned this before we built our home, and it came in very useful.

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  10. Joe M said: Tolling also has a large infrastructure and bookkeeping cost associated with it compared to a much simpler property tax.

    The infrastructure and bookkeeping costs for road tolls isn’t that large. TfL had gross revenues of £257.4M in 2014, and a net income of £172.5M. Initial set-up costs were £161.7M. While property tax is much simpler, it doesn’t address the fact of the disproportionate benefit of outside users that don’t pay Toronto property taxes, but regularly use Toronto roads.

    Keeping with the TfL example, the weekly charge for London residents is £4.00, while the same-day charge is £11.50 or the next-day charge is £14.00.

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  11. @Mapleson: While property tax is much simpler, it doesn’t address the fact of the disproportionate benefit of outside users that don’t pay Toronto property taxes, but regularly use Toronto roads

    Well that’s where the Province is supposed to come in to fund the “disproportionate” benefit. Road tolls cost more, provide a special privilege to the rich and optically piss off commuters outside the core. Tolls are not needed whatsoever.

    Political will is what is needed. We need to set up a long term tax plan from all levels … But unfortunately it looks as though we still have a few years of Politicians skirting the reality with nickel and dime tacky inadequate solutions or even worse selling off assets to the private sector for a one time influx to create a mirage that this is sustainable without a sustainable long term plan.

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  12. Joe M said:

    Well that’s where the Province is supposed to come in to fund the “disproportionate” benefit. Road tolls cost more, provide a special privilege to the rich and optically piss off commuters outside the core. Tolls are not needed whatsoever.

    Again, you are framing the context as toll lanes, not road tolls. Do you prefer the term ‘congestion charges’? Having to pay $4 per week to own a car while living in Toronto isn’t much of a “special privilege to the rich”. Tolls are needed to combat the practice of the surrounding Regions from attracting Toronto jobs and development by offering lower taxes based on their proximity to Toronto and ability to leach off its infrastructure investments. Congestion charges would give people a reason to live in Scarborough instead of Markham. Congestion charges would discourage York Region drivers from using the DVP, so residents of North York and Scarborough would have faster commutes.

    Provincially and federally, the balance has always been that the population centres subsidize the hinterland. Their tax rates are equal across their geographic boundaries. Thus, it’s at the municipal level that the inbalance in municipal usage and taxes needs to be fought.

    Joe M said:

    But unfortunately it looks as though we still have a few years of Politicians skirting the reality with nickel and dime tacky inadequate solutions or even worse selling off assets to the private sector for a one time influx to create a mirage that this is sustainable without a sustainable long term plan.

    You’re talking about the OPC selling off a chuck of Ontario Hydro and 99-year lease of the 407, right? 😉 Asset sales are rarely a good long-term idea, but they are politically expedient for both sides of the political spectrum.

    I believe in a high tax, high social-investment society, but Ontario has been crushed between various global trends for the last 30 years. To successfully raise taxes you have to be elected on a higher taxes mandate, have generally positive economic conditions in your term, and win a second term, so that your policies have enough time for the effects to be seen.

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  13. Mapleson wrote:

    I believe in a high tax, high social-investment society, but Ontario has been crushed between various global trends for the last 30 years. To successfully raise taxes you have to be elected on a higher taxes mandate, have generally positive economic conditions in your term, and win a second term, so that your policies have enough time for the effects to be seen.

    Not only that, but ANYONE running when the electorate is used to a “high tax, low social-investment” modus operandi, makes it nearly impossible for any political stripe to run on anything but changing the first half of that as a minimum, if not changing both halves.

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